The Duke

A friend from YouTube will be responding here from questions that I asked him and points that I made. The example used in this portion of the debate is the Eucharist and the Last Supper.


For my references, I will only use Catholic sources such as the Catechsim and the New King James Version Bible.

I was asked: So MrsM, do you accept that Jesus (God) said to men that they could bind things on Earth and those things are bound in Heaven? If something is bound in Heaven can it be fallible?
Matt 16:18-19 and Matt 18:18

I responded: If it is something that goes against scripture, then it is not valid.

What happens if the 'whatsoever' was against something in scripture? For example, the 'continuing' sacrifice of Christ even though when He died, He said "It is finished".

Christ did say it was His flesh, I am not disagreeing with you. What Christ meant and we see it in further teachings, is that Christ is the Bread of life. We have to have food and drink to survive, correct? So with Christ saying it was real food and real drink, He meant that we need Him to live, not in this life but the next. Why do you think Christ called Himself 'bread'? In John 6 Jesus is referred to as " the Bread from Heaven".

John 6:33 "For the bread of God is He who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.

John 6:35 "I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.

John 6:50-51 "50 This is the bread which comes down from heaven, that one may eat of it and not die. 51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever; and the bread that I shall give is My flesh, which I shall give for the life of the world.

Do you see the symbolism that Jesus used in this teaching? His flesh was represented by the bread, flesh that would be broken. It is not a literal flesh, as cannibalism is condemned in scripture.

Christ says to do this in remembrance (Luke 22:18-20 and others) It was for remembering what Christ did, proclaiming His death. Not a renewing sacrifice of Christ.

Christ said "It is finished" and that there would be no more offerings. John 19:30 and Hebrews 10:11 and 18.

From New Advent Catholic Encyclopedia, the Eucharist is the on-going sacrifice of Christ. That idea is echoed in the catechsim.

1368 The Eucharist is also the sacrifice of the Church. Christ's sacrifice present on the altar makes it possible for all generations of Christians to be united with his offering.

1436 It is made present the sacrifice of Christ which has reconciled us with God.It is a remedy to free us from our daily faults and to preserve us from mortal sins."

1360 The Eucharist is a sacrifice of thanksgiving

1366 The Eucharist is thus a sacrifice because it re-presents (makes present) the sacrifice of the cross (This one continues to say it is a memorial but that does not consist with the rest of the catechsim)

1414 As sacrifice, the Eucharist is also offered in reparation for the sins of the living and the dead and to obtain spiritual or temporal benefits from God.

I will stop here, I feel that I have given enough from the catechism.(http://ccc.scborromeo.org.master.com/texis/master/search/?sufs=0&q=eucharist+sacrifice&xsubmit=Search&s=SS)

Now I will use the other source that I spoke of earlier.

We first must look at what communion/the Last Supper is.

Luke 22:17-10 "17 Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and said, Take this and divide it among yourselves; 18 for I say to you,[b] I will not drink of the fruit of the vine until the kingdom of God comes.
19 And He took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, This is My body which is given for you; do this in remembrance of Me.
20 Likewise He also took the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is shed for you. "

I Corinthians 11:23-26 "23 For I received from the Lord that which I also delivered to you: that the Lord Jesus on the same night in which He was betrayed took bread; 24 and when He had given thanks, He broke it and said, Take, eat;[b] this is My body which is broken[c] for you; do this in remembrance of Me. 25 In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me.
26 For as often as you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lords death till He comes."

Christ teaches here that it is a remembrance of the blood and body that was to be shed and broken. Christ does not teach us that it is an offering of sin or that by partaking in it, we are forgiven of sin. On the contrary, we are to examine ourselves before we partake in it.

I Corinthians 11:27-29 "Therefore whoever eats this bread or drinks this cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of the body and blood[d] of the Lord. 28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For he who eats and drinks in an unworthy manner[e] eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the Lords[f] body"

Let's take a quick look at John 6. Verses 22-40 is Christ speaking about the Bread from Heaven and how He is the bread from Heaven. Verse 35 "I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst."

John 6: 54-58 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. 55 For My flesh is food indeed,[h] and My blood is drink indeed. 56 He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him. 57 As the living Father sent Me, and I live because of the Father, so he who feeds on Me will live because of Me. 58 This is the bread which came down from heaven—not as your fathers ate the manna, and are dead. He who eats this bread will live forever.

What must we do to have eternal life? Salvation. And where does salvation come from? Jesus Christ.




There is a saying from the catechism that I would like to bring up.

1414 As sacrifice, the Eucharist is also offered in reparation for the sins of the living and the dead and to obtain spiritual or temporal benefits from God.

First let me note that we are told in Psalms 49 that we cannot redeem our brother nor pay a ransom for him. Second, this is very clearly talking about a sin offering. "Offered in reparation of the sins'.

John 19:30
So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, It is finished! And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.

Hebrews 10:18
Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.

Hebrews 10:11 "11 And every priest stands ministering daily and offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins.

We are to partake in remembrance, not trying to have our sins forgiven, or to try to forgive the sins of someone else, or to try to receive benefits. It is for the purposes of remembrance and to proclaim Jesus' death.